87 FBird with high mileage 2.8 question

[TTrax]

Hey everyone and thanks for the help in advance. I have an 87 firebird with about 345,000 miles on it. It has been an awesome car and I couldn't have asked for a better experience with it, virtually no engine problems whatsoever. I did have a trans problem and had it rebuilt. Whenever I was installing the transmission I decided to replace the flexplate since I had been hearing a light ticking noise from rear of the engine. When I was taking the old one off and putting the new one on I noticed that I could rotate the crank about 1 to 1.5 inches on the outer circumference of the flexplate. I dont know how many degrees this is exactly but it has me a little worried. Everyone that I talked to thinks that maybe I need to check the cam chain. I imagine that it is pretty well stretched since I bought the car at 140K miles and haven't done anything to it since then.

BTW, the ticking noise can not be heard above 2K rpms, and if you blip the throttle just a hair it doubles in frequency for a sec. I put a stethescope all over the engine and the loudest seems to be on the fuel rail. Thanks!

[55trucker]

About the crank being able to move......if it can move *relatively* freely for a small amount in either direction then stops I'd have to agree with what you've been told..the cam chain is extremely sloppy. With the mileage you have on the engine that would be expected. Don't really want to try to diagnose the ticking problem from here....but...does it double in frequency (pitch)..or speed?...if the speed of the tick changes with engine rpm, you may have an injector motor *tick*. Hard to say from this point.

[TTrax]

It changes in speed not pitch. I really don't know what else can be causing this. The car actually caught on fire several years ago, resulting in me having to replace the engine wiring harness and an injector. I don't know if one of the other injectors may have got cooked a little bit, but still works. I definantly want to look about getting the chain and sprockets serviced after hearing some of the experiences that others have had when the chain has broke or slipped. Thanks for the help again!

[55trucker]

Does that engine make use of a single cold start injector?....can't remember if the 2.8 in the mid 80's Firebirds were DIS or distributor ignition. One of the fire hazards was the failing of the cold start injector o-ring. If you're going to go to the effort to replace the timing chain assembly might as well pull the fuel rail and replace all of the necessary O-rings and the cold start injector O-ring as well. Can't hurt and might prevent a second fire.

[IsaacHayes]

My car had a ticking noise on startup. Many people said lifters or piston slap. It was the chain. It was stretched a bit and the guide rubber was hard and brittle like plastic. $30 later (had to replace a leaky timing cover gasket anyways) and it's like new. Now you CAN hear the injectors!! hahaha And I do have piston slap, but you have to get down under the car to hear that, and it's more of a knock noise, but goes away once warmed up. I replaced the chain right around 200,000 miles on mine.

I agree, chain. Being RWD it won't be as hard as it was in my FWD car to replace!!!

[TTrax]

Actually, the cause of the original fire was because of that o-ring. My girlfriend was driving the car at the time and smelled fuel. About a minute later she felt a light thump under the hood, then black smoke started billowing out. She popped the hood... flames came rushing out. Luckily she was near a school zone and a cop was able to put out the fire.

Turned out it wasn't as bad as I thought, just had to replace a fuel injector and the wiring harness, distributor, and windshield wiper motor. I went to the local GM dealership to see about getting the cold start injector oring and was told at that time that GM no longer made the parts that i needed. So I went back home and installed a plug in the fuel rail. I little hard to start in cold weather sometimes but I get by. I don't suppose anyone knows if the o-ring is still available somewhere? I would love to get it fixed right. Thanks again for all the help!

[55trucker]

Is there a hydraulic shop in the neighborhood where you live? A shop that makes up and does repairs to all sorts of hydraulic hoses and pumps. That would probably be your best bet for various sized O-rings.....or possibly a diesel shop.

[TTrax]

I will do some checking around here for o-rings. Is it a standard size, or something special? I can't remember for sure, but at the dealership I thought the pic I was shown represented a special o-ring. It has been awhile since I looked, though. I was also reading through some of the past forum posts on timing chains and seen that the Cloyes ones seem to stretch a lot. Has anyone found a better alternative other than one from the dealership? Thanks again.

[1meanz]

i got mine from comp cams. never had any problems with it. was in an s10. ended up having like 300,000 on that one lol. sold the truck. and its still goin

check into it, dont just take my word. but im 99% sure this is it. i beleave if it fits one 60* it fits them all and heres the one we got.

http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CC&Product_Code=3201&Category_Code=CHEV466Time

[55trucker]

I went thru this same repair earlier this summer with my son's cars engine. You'll need to pull the fuel line off from the fuel rail and back off the retaining bolt holding the injector to the intake, slip out the injector from the intake & take it with you to a shop to get the O-ring. You'll have to pull the line off the engine anyway to change the O-ring. I wouldn't try to bend the line trying to get the O-ring out, you may break the line and they are not too common to find anymore. The o-ring is a neoprene item not rubber.

[TTrax]

Alright thanks for the advice on the cam chain and injector removal. I will give it a shot as soon as I get some time off work. Thanks again!!

[TTrax]

Nice Fiero engine pic there... I always wanted one of those when I was a kid. I still do but they are kinda hard to find around here these days.