Distributor Oil Pump Drive Plug

[1988GTU]

The only other thing that I can think of that might cause the area around the OPD/Engine Block to leak so readily after replacing the old "O" Ring with a new one ...is if during the block machining or re-conditioning, someone used either a boring tool in that vertical hole leading down into the block or some type of honing tool to clean out the old crud just a bit too enthusiastically and removed enough metal to make even a new "O" Ring on the OPD Unit fit in there width too much slop. But having considered your original suggestion about wanting to "weld" the operation closed, your original thought about this have given me a new idea that might really solve the problem:

JB-Weld

It occurred to me that if you examined the area of the block opening where the the OPD mates on contact with the "O" Ring... if you were to find any real irregularities, cracks or damage within its inner race...that once cleaned and re-cleaned immaculately with a strong, de-greasing solvent...perhaps you could "re-line" that inner race with a smoothed over coating of JB_Weld that would solve both problems of filling in any irregularities... and also serve to slightly enlarge the inner diameter, making the contact with the "O" Ring that much more snug and less likely to leak.

Also... the heat signature in that part of the engine block would not be high enough to defeat the contact between the JB_Weld and the cast iron as long as the surfaces are properly cleaned and prepped before the application of the stuff. After all, there have been some cases where people have used JB-Weld to fill in the cracks on interior cylinder walls and then after re-machining have never had any problems with it! If this idea were to work as suggested... you might wind up get the "welding" solution you wanted in the first place after all!

Bad idea. Cast not stable to hold the jbweld. The jbweld could break apart still or just fall down and onto the cam/gear and then cause it to bind. Results would be fatal for the engine and very damaging for the owners pocket book. There is enough 'give' with the hex drive/gear unit and pump that a 1/16" gasket will not cause any ill effects for the longevity of the engine.

'The Right Stuff' and cork gasket with very thoroughly cleaning prior to installation will likely be very adequate for keeping oil where it belongs.

[60dgrzbelow0]

The only other thing that I can think of that might cause the area around the OPD/Engine Block to leak so readily after replacing the old "O" Ring with a new one ...is if during the block machining or re-conditioning, someone used either a boring tool in that vertical hole leading down into the block or some type of honing tool to clean out the old crud just a bit too enthusiastically and removed enough metal to make even a new "O" Ring on the OPD Unit fit in there with too much slop. But having considered your original suggestion about wanting to "weld" the operation closed, your original thought about this have given me a new idea that might really solve the problem:

JB-Weld

It occurred to me that if you examined the area of the block opening where the the OPD mates on contact with the "O" Ring... if you were to find any real irregularities, cracks or damage within its inner race...that once cleaned and re-cleaned immaculately with a strong, de-greasing solvent...perhaps you could "re-line" that inner race with a smoothed over coating of JB_Weld that would solve both problems of filling in any irregularities... and also serve to slightly enlarge the inner diameter, making the contact with the "O" Ring that much more snug and less likely to leak.

Also... the heat signature in that part of the engine block would not be high enough to defeat the contact between the JB_Weld and the cast iron as long as the surfaces are properly cleaned and prepped before the application of the stuff. After all, there have been some cases where people have used JB-Weld to fill in the cracks on interior cylinder walls and then after re-machining have never had any problems with it! If this idea were to work as suggested... you might wind up get the "welding" solution you wanted in the first place after all!

[Ghettoracer]

I guess the only real question is: What will permanently seal it from leaking ever again? I mean you have 2 things working against that seal, heat and oil. Overtime the heat will make the o-ring to shrink and shrivel and the oil will break it down. I'm just trying to find out if there is a "permanent" fix so it doesn't leak ever. I know installing a new ring would do it but should I glob on a shit load of RTV sealant around it or just make it a permanent fix and welding to the the engine. I know all of you had your share of leaks in your time that tends to get annoying over time and your garage floor is starting to look like the Exxon Valdez oil spill. And rigging is using duct tape to fix things.

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

lol if this plus guy is giving me points, thats the second one ive gotten, making me #2. and we all know #2 is the shit. THE Shit. lol

[pocket-rocket]

key word is fix. lol

Fix, not rig

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

half assed fix, or proper fix.... key word is fix. lol

[pocket-rocket]

I will be sure to pull the one out of my 91 when I part it out to have a look since it's been that way for years (gasket sandwiched between silicone) and reved up to over 7k many many many times that way. I doubt anything came of it though since a gasket isn't very thick and silicone spreads even thinner in this case.

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

guess you better tighten that shit down real good.

the explanation does present a valid point... i guess we will have to see. the only noise my engine makes is when i first start it up i have some sticky lifters, but a minute later and the rattling goes away... oh and i can REALLY hear my injectors clicking too! lol if i have the cover off for them and start it it sounds pretty loud. but other than that, so far no noise or oil leaks.

[60dgrzbelow0]

Well when I have a top end off I do it both ways... New brown o-ring and a gasket, but I use black silicone. I have yet to have one leak this way.

Just Food for Thought but...

The only problem I can see that might arise with using an additional sealing gasket under the lower lip surface area of the Oil pump Drive and the upper mating surface of the engine block is that if the gasket material is thick enough, it might change the relational depth of the mating areas between the helical drive gear on the OPD and the helical gear teeth on the camshaft moving them out of their optimum mating positions.

Also, this additional height of a raised OPD might allow the hex drive shaft mating inside the oil pump, which is ordinarily fairly snug once the OPD is pushed deep inside the block hole and the holding clamp is torqued down to specs, to have too much vertical play. Under the changing torque dynamics of increasing/decreasing RPM, this extra play can cause the mating gears to allow the OPD to walk up and down and perhaps cause the Hex Drive Shaft to chatter and vibrate up and down as well. Any additional mechanical vibrations in this 'stack' of components can only invite added wear and part failure of the gear teeth and invite damage to both the Oil Pump Drive and the Oil Pump as well.

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

i did mine about a month ago. so i cant make any promises. but i did it without taking the head off, without taking either intake off...

[pocket-rocket]

Well when I have a top end off I do it both ways... New brown o-ring and a gasket, but I use black silicone. I have yet to have one leak this way.

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

o ring?? no... paper gasket with gasket maker on it... ill bet on that alot longer.

[pocket-rocket]

And a brown one only runs $2-3 at the dealer.

[60dgrzbelow0]

You know how they have that plug on the top side that always leaks at the o-ring? Can't you be able to fashion a freeze plug in there and weld it flush and not worry about an oil leak? Seems kind dumb to put a plug with an o-ring that will deteriorate over time.

Welding a dynamic component to the block may not be such a good idea for too many reasons to mention. The oil leaking problem has an interesting history though that may prove useful in what might really be going wrong. After the late 1980's and early 1990's problems that occurred with the original "Black O-Ring" hardening, cracking and leaking, GM opted to use the "Brown" O-Ring made of PTFE (Poly-Tetra-Flouro-Ethylene) AKA "TEFLON". The engineers tested this material also for use with the pressure inner coil style seals for the main bearing journal seals. In both cases, the only problem they observed was "...the PTFE does tend to 'wander' a bit and leak on the main bearing seals after 175,000 miles, due to the effects of gravity as opposed to either chemical or thermal attacks on the seal itself." In both applications, these work exceedingly well and durably resist oil and gas degradation and hardening/cracking breakdowns. It is very likely that is you are having serious oil leaks around the sealing areas of the Oil Pump Drive, then your OP Drive may have had a "Black" O-Ring installed incorrectly (originally designed for the 2.8L engines and later abandoned as hopeless and a major failure in GM's choice of materials). I have heard that these "Black" O-Rings are making there way back onto the repair markets and if used in lieu of the "Brown" O-Rings...the leaking problem rears its ugly head once again. For more images and information, please visit my photo-bucket. There are several albums other than this specific one on my site that show the various 60* part images and part numbers if this information is necessary:

http://s557.photobucket.com/albums/ss19/60dgrzbelow0/ANEWV6OILPUMPRIMINGTOOL/

[SofaKingWeToddDid]

well, thats why we dont weld it shut i guess.
i can get a ring of gasket material (covered in gasket maker) under it and this is after cleaning it out a little too! in about an hour! no lies!!!