External Crank Trigger

[SappySE107]

http://60degreev6.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=42

For pushrod motors, especially designed for the 3500 swap using other computers. Includes bolts to crank pulley that aren't pictured. $120 plus shipping.

[IsaacHayes]

Was it ever figured out if they'll work for L bodies with the dogbone mount bracket bolt hole? Are they made with tollerance for that, and other cars that don't have that bolt boss in use, you add a shim?

EDIT: AFAIK bolting this on top of the bracket in an L body would mean it's moved out farther from the crank pulley. You'd have to shim the trigger wheel then. I was thinking perhaps it's "made for" the L body, and if a car doesn't have the bracket underneath, you add a shim to bring it back out. I guess we'll have to wait and find out when someone attemps it.. _shrug_ J-bodies might be simalar. Or I might be wrong about the bolt boss being used. But as far as I can tell, it is. W-bodies of course don't have this "problem".

[SappySE107]

FIXED --- I moved your post to this thread, and since its dated first it gets top post:P Thats funny. BTS


So anyway, I am not aware of it having a problem in an L body but I really don't know. I was told that it can be shimmed if needed so long as the sensor lines up with the notched wheel. Perhaps Marc can post all the important details.

[CNCguy]

I ended up making them for W bodies since no one was able to give me the thickness of the bracket on L bodies. They can still be used on other applications with the use of some washers/shims behind the reluctor wheel. The alternative is to cut/grind the back of the mount off to allow for the bracket. If we get a dimension, I can send some to Ben that are "to size" and no additional work will be required.

Hopefully withing the next few weeks, we will have a 3500 running on OBD-I using one of these. And if my son gets moving, we will be doing a 3500 swap in a '96 Lumina with OBD-II.

[IsaacHayes]

Ah I see. I'm not sure if the 2nd gen J-body has the same type of bracket/mount. I know they have a lower dogbone so probably so. Perhaps someone from the J-body crowd would be able to measure it. If I've ever got my car apart in that area I'll try to measure it with it on the car as best I can, whever that might be.

[Ortie666]

Does this plug into the computer or the coil packs??? in other words do i need a computer fot this to work??

[ryan.hess]

Coil packs, and no. (but there will be no spark advance... which won't be good for performance at all... but you asked..)

[Ortie666]

"Allows for adjusting your ignition timing +5 to -10 degrees from stock." ,
so couldent i just re-position it for advance or retard??? or have it mounted on a bracket so it could swivle up or down giving me advance or retard??

[ryan.hess]

Do you know how a distributor works? That's like setting the "base timing". You still need it to add 20+ degrees advance under load and RPM.

[CNCguy]

"Allows for adjusting your ignition timing +5 to -10 degrees from stock." ,
so couldent i just re-position it for advance or retard??? or have it mounted on a bracket so it could swivle up or down giving me advance or retard??

Actually, it is engraved for +10/-5 but can be moved as much as +15 degreees.

Timing changes with RPM & load. Without the changes, it would really suck.

[Ortie666]

Well it would be just like me not running my vac advance witch i do.. do once in a wile already. I was also thinking of running forced induction and in that case i wouldent be able to hook up the vac. adv. anyway. But if the trigger hooks rite into the coil pack then what changes the timing wile driving, or is there another wire that goes to the packs from the computer to tell them to advance or retard??

[CNCguy]

Well it would be just like me not running my vac advance witch i do.. do once in a wile already. I was also thinking of running forced induction and in that case i wouldent be able to hook up the vac. adv. anyway. But if the trigger hooks rite into the coil pack then what changes the timing wile driving, or is there another wire that goes to the packs from the computer to tell them to advance or retard??

The coil packs are mounted on the ICM (Ignition Control Module). The ICM gets a signal from the CPS for the base timing and a signal from the ECM for the timing advance.

If your distributor is not hooked to a computer, it has two types of advance, mechanical (weights & springs under the rotor) and vacuum (external diaphragm). To see the true effects of "no advance", you need to disable the mechanical advance feature of you distributor. In the early years, before centrifugal advance was invented, cars had a lever on the steering column to adjust the advance while driving.

[Ortie666]

Ok, understood now,! so the next question is, If i were to get an ecm and hook up some of the base things for it to work, then theroreticly it could change my timing, but... what are those base things?? ign, power, ground, cam sensor, vacume sensor,exe.
as you guys can tell im kinda new to the computer thing on cars, but im tryin to do somthing crazy were i cant use my stock distributor anymore, but there will be carborators instead of throdle bodies.. Thanks all up till this!!

[SappySE107]

You will need the MAP sensor, IAT sensor, Coolant temp sensor, the CPS, Knock Sensor or a dummy setup to foolthe ECM into thinking its there anyway, power/grounds. Its going to be odd for the ECM though because it won't be controlling fuel. Probably have to program it not try to adjust fueling (set BLM and INT to 12. Possibly disabling codes and such would keep it from using base timing or retarded timing because of its input errors. I haven't played with doing this but it should be possible to use the ECM for just spark.

[prophiseer]

outta curiosity, someone with a 3400 could use this to adjust base ignition advance, right?